CONTACTS
SUBJECTS
Water Heater Rheem Model 22V501 Serial RHLN0206Z19998 Installed 0604
Warranty New Water Heater
2704 -
2704 - ..
2705 - Summary/Objective
2706 -
270601 - Follow up ref SDS 4 0000. ref SDS 3 0000.
270602 -
270603 -
270604 -
270605 -
270606 -
270607 -
270609 - ..
2707 -
2708 -
2709 - Progress
2710 -
271001 - Background reported on 110203 2149. ref SDS 4 T65H
271003 - ..
271004 - Kevin Moeller visit with...
271005 -
271006 - Diablo Rooter Company
271007 - 925 827 1332
271009 - ..
271010 - Inspect and repair...
271011 -
271012 - Rheem Guardian 50 gallon water heater
271013 - Serial Number............. RHLN 0206Z19998
271014 - Model..................... 22V501
271015 -
271016 - ...originally installed on 060411. ref SDS 3 HC56 Transaction
271017 - with Diablo Rooter Company...
271019 - ..
271020 - Invoice........................... 49943
271021 - Total cost........................ $875
271022 - Paid check #...................... 201 dated 060411
271024 - ..
271025 - Kevin indicated in the call last night that replacing the water heater
271026 - would cost about $1,200, reported on 110203 2149, ref SDS 4 6F3P
271027 -
271028 - [On 170214 0931 received letter from MondySavingPro.com
271029 - explaining Home Warranty Insurance to cover all routine
271030 - home and appliance repairs for cost of $300 to $500
271031 - annually. ref SDS 10 EM73
271032 -
271033 - https://www.moneysavingpro.com/home-warranty/
271035 - ..
271036 - SDS record shows Kevin notified 5 years ago on 060411 that new water
271037 - heater was warranted for 6 years, and so Diablo Rooter will make
271038 - repairs at no extra cost. ref SDS 3 EE47
271039 -
271041 - ..
2711 -
2712 -
2713 - 1038
2714 -
271401 - This morning, on site Kevin inspected the water heater and reported
271402 - that in his professional opinion it has failed within the terms of
271403 - the warranty.
271405 - ..
271406 - Kevin called the manufacturer, Rheem, to make a claim under the
271407 - warranty, as agreed on 060411 0721. ref SDS 3 EE4I
271408 -
271410 - ..
2715 -
2716 -
2717 - 1049
2718 -
271801 - Kevin explains to Rheem warranty claims agent...
271802 -
271803 - 1. Rheem 22v501 water heater installed on 060411. ref SDS 3
271804 - 026H
271806 - ..
271807 - Located in upstairs utility closet adjacent to furnace.
271809 - ..
271810 - 2. Unit was purchased for the customer from...
271811 -
271812 - Heieck Supply
271813 - 1857 Arnold Industrial Way
271814 - Concord, CA 94520
271815 - 925 671 0800
271817 - ..
271818 - http://www.merchantcircle.com/business/Heieck.Supply.925-671-0800/products
271820 - ..
271821 - 3. Water heater leaking from the bottom, drip pan is half
271822 - full, and overflow is draining to the ouside.
271824 - ..
271825 - 4. Hot and cold piping extending from the top of the water
271826 - heater have caved in on themselves, indicating leaking from
271827 - above as well.
271829 - ..
271830 - Reference number....
271831 -
271832 - [...for some reason did not get Rheem reference number on
271833 - this transaction.]
271835 - ..
271836 - Rheem refused to perform work replacing the unit. Rheem will only
271837 - pay to replace the water heater and required parts citing warranty
271838 - provisions that say in part...
271839 -
271840 - This Limited Warranty does not cover any labor expenses for
271841 - service, repairs, reinstallation, permits, or removal and
271842 - disposal of the failed water heater, or defective component
271843 - part(s). All such expenses are your responsibility.
271845 - ..
271846 - If an exact replacement is not available, Rheem will provide
271847 - you with the current model of your water heater, or component
271848 - part(s), or a replacement unit with comparable operating
271849 - features. If government regulations or industry certification
271850 - or similar standards require the replacement water heater, or
271851 - replacement component part(s), to have features not found in
271852 - the defective water heater, or the defective component part(s),
271853 - you will be charged for the difference in price represented by
271854 - those required features. If you pay the price difference for
271855 - those required features and/or to upgrade the size and/or other
271856 - features available on a replacement new water heater, you will
271857 - also receive a complete new Limited Warranty (with the full
271858 - Applicable Warranty Period) for the replacement new water
271859 - heater.
271861 - ..
271862 - Kevin told the Rheem agent that the customer was notified terms of
271863 - sale for the water heater on 060411, included making repairs at no
271864 - extra cost under the warranty. ref SDS 3 EE47 If Rheem fails to honor
271865 - the warranty, then customers will stop ordering Rheem products.
271867 - ..
271868 - After talking to Rheem, Kevin says cost of labor today for removal and
271869 - installation will be $200.
271871 - ..
271872 - He said the replacement water heater will use same fittings and
271873 - configuration.
271875 - ..
271876 - Since we need hot water, agreed to pay Diablo Rooter $200, so work can
271877 - proceed, while Rheem error refusing to honor warranty is investigated
271878 - and resolved.
271879 -
271880 - [On 170214 0931 received letter from MondySavingPro.com
271881 - explaining Home Warranty Insurance to cover all routine
271882 - home and appliance repairs for cost of $300 to $500
271883 - annually. ref SDS 10 EM73
271884 -
271885 - https://www.moneysavingpro.com/home-warranty/
271887 - ..
271888 - Kevin removes failed water heater and drives to Heieck Supply get a
271889 - replacement under the Rheem warranty, as agreed on 060411 0721.
271890 - ref SDS 3 026H
271891 -
271892 -
271893 -
271895 - ..
2719 -
2720 -
2721 - 1704
2722 -
272201 - Kevin returns with new water heater. He explained this is a "new
272202 - improved" water heater design that takes less energy.
272203 -
272204 -
272205 -
272206 -
272207 -
272208 -
2723 -
SUBJECTS
Default Null Subject Account for Blank Record
2803 -
280401 - ..
280402 - Thermal Expansion Caused Water Heater Failed Added Tank to New Unit
280403 -
280404 - Kevin said he was told by his contact at Heieck Supply, where he
280405 - exchanged the failed water heater for a new one, ref SDS 0 JY4F, that
280406 - the old water heater failed due to "thermal expansion" that was
280407 - compounded by the unit being located in an enclosed utility closet
280408 - upstairs. In this case the water heater and the home heating
280409 - equipment are both in the same utility closet.
280411 - ..
280412 - Heieck recommends adding a "thermal expansion tank" to prevent future
280413 - failure due to thermal expansion. The Heieck agent feels the original
280414 - water heater failed on 060411, because the contractor failed to
280415 - install a thermal expansion tank.
280417 - ..
280418 - This presents a design, performance, and durability issue...
280420 - ..
280421 - The record is unclear why the original water lasted at least 10 years
280422 - without a thermal expansion unit, and the "new improved" water heater
280423 - installed on 060411, failed in less than 6 years?
280425 - ..
280426 - Asked about Rheem published guidance on adding thermal expansion tank?
280428 - ..
280429 - Kevin said he is just going by what his friend at Heieck Supply told
280430 - him today. Kevin suggested contacting Rheem directly for their
280431 - comments on this requirement.
280433 - ..
280434 - This evening, Kevin said we are lucky, because he just happens to have
280435 - a thermal expansion tank on his truck intended for another customer,
280436 - but which was not installed.
280438 - ..
280439 - Today, Kevin used the tank not needed for another customer to install
280440 - this thermal expansion tank at the top of the water heater, and using
280441 - a horizontal extension on the water line that inflows to the water
280442 - heater. This configuration looks odd. It is not clear why thermal
280443 - expansion will not be relieved into the inflow cold water line without
280444 - the thermal expansion tank.
280445 -
280446 - [...below on 110204 1030 at 2217 research on the Internet
280447 - seems to show Kevin installed the thermal expansion tank
280448 - according to industry standards. ref SDS 0 TM3H
280450 - ..
280451 - Asked Kevin for manufacturer's installatonn schematic showing
280452 - recommended configuration.
280454 - ..
280455 - Kevin said the manufacturer does not provide installation schematics.
280456 - He explained having made this installation many times, and so feels
280457 - the configuration he installed is correct.
280458 -
280459 - [On 110209 1016 research on Internet found Use and Care
280460 - manual for Rheem water heater that seems to support for
280461 - configuration installed by Diablo Rooter today. ref SDS 6
280462 - IO5N
280464 - ..
280465 - Kevin indicated that if the original water heater was configured with
280466 - a thermal expansion tank, it would not have failed after 11 years on
280467 - 060411, and if Diaglo Rooter had installed a thermal expansion tank on
280468 - the Rheem water heater installed on 060411, it would not have failed
280469 - after 5 years, as it did within the warranty period.
280471 - ..
280472 - Inspection found a leak in the overflow line coming from near the top
280473 - of the unit. This is a soldered copper elbow joint. Kevin
280474 - disconnected the joint. He shook the pipe to remove water, then
280475 - reconnected and soldered the joint.
280477 - ..
280478 - Kevin expressed appreciation for opportunity to correct the prior
280479 - work.
280480 -
280481 -
280482 -
280483 -
280485 - ..
2805 -
2806 -
2807 - 1816
2808 -
280801 - Received invoice from Diablo Rooter...
280802 -
280803 - Diablo Rooter
280804 - Lic 510112
280805 - PO Box 4419
280806 - Walnut Creek, CA 94596
280807 - 925 934 1944
280815 - ..
280816 - Invoice.............................. 60233
280817 - Due and payable upon presentation
280818 - Date................................. 110204
280819 - Check................................ YBFBPX6R
280821 - ..
280822 - Parts Supplied...
280823 -
280824 - Rheem Guardian 50 gallon water heater................... $137
280825 - Serial Number........................ RHUN 1210U10873
280826 - Model................................ 22V50FN
280827 - Capacity US gallons.................. 48
280828 - Manufactured......................... 101222
280829 - Input BTUH........................... 40,000
280830 - Type gas............................. Natural
280831 - GAS PRESS. IN.W.C. - MANIFOLD - ..... 5.0
280832 - Max. Inlet........................... 10.5
280833 - Min. Inlet........................... 5.0
280834 - ANS.................................. Z21.10.1*
280835 - CSA.................................. 4.1-2009
280837 - ..
280838 - COMPLIES WITH JURISDICTIONS HAVING 10ng/J NOx Regulations
280840 - ..
280841 - Thermo expansion tank................................... 40
280842 - 18" NXN water flex line................................. 10
280843 - 24" NXN water flex line................................. 10
280844 - 3/4 brass tee........................................... 10
280845 - 3/4 brass coupling...................................... 5
280846 - 3/4 brass pipe 3 at $8.................................. 24
280847 - Gas trap................................................ 10
280848 -
280849 - 246 $246
280851 - ..
280852 - Labor services 2.25 hours............................... 245
280854 - ..
280855 - Replaced Rheem 50 gallon water heater under warranty. Tank was
280856 - leaking. Rheem warrenty parts 1 year and tank six years labor one
280857 - year. Put on thermoexpansion tank. ref SDS 0 TL7H
280859 - ..
280860 - Rheem.............. 1 800 621 5622
280861 - SN................. RHUN 1210U 10873
280862 - MN................. 22V50 FN
280864 - ..
280865 - Total................................................... $ 491
280867 - ..
280868 - For some reason, Kevin added this up to $492.
280869 -
280870 - [On 120323 1236 submitted rental payment of $1125 on new 2
280871 - year lease agreement, and deducted $492 for water heater
280872 - replacement, for net payment of $733, ref SDS 9 HM3J;
280873 - discovered overpaid $100, so will deduct from payment for
280874 - rent next month. ref SDS 9 SH4K
280876 - ..
280877 - Post expense ledger...
280878 -
280882 - ..
280883 - Payments issued through Wells Fargo online include...
280884 -
280885 - 110204..................... $492.00 ...... ref SDS 0 EI8F
280887 - ..
280888 - Paid with Wells Fargon online................. $492.00
280889 -
280890 - Reference...................... CB5BEXKI
280891 - Paid........................... 110204
280892 - Send payment on................ 110205
280893 - Deliver by..................... 110209
280894 -
280895 -
280896 -
280898 - ..
280899 - Extended 6 Year Warranty
280900 -
280901 - Kevin said the water heater has a new guarentee of 6 years. He
280902 - submitted a copy of the warranty, ref OF 1, and saying in part...
280903 -
280904 - If an exact replacement is not available, Rheem will provide
280905 - you with the current model of your water heater, or component
280906 - part(s), or a replacement unit with comparable operating
280907 - features. If government regulations or industry certification
280908 - or similar standards require the replacement water heater, or
280909 - replacement component part(s), to have features not found in
280910 - the defective water heater, or the defective component part(s),
280911 - you will be charged for the difference in price represented by
280912 - those required features. If you pay the price difference for
280913 - those required features and/or to upgrade the size and/or other
280914 - features available on a replacement new water heater, you will
280915 - also receive a complete new Limited Warranty (with the full
280916 - Applicable Warranty Period) for the replacement new water
280917 - heater. ref OF 1 S297
280919 - ..
280920 - Kevin advised that the customer can rely on Diablo Rooter to make
280921 - repairs at no extra cost, as agreed for the prior water heater,
280922 - reported on 060411 0721. ref SDS 3 EE47
280924 - ..
280925 - After Kevin left, noticed several ways hot water service has
280926 - improved...
280927 -
280928 - 1. Water is now much hotter than before.
280929 - 2. Hot water pressure is much higher.
280931 - ..
280932 - Won't know until PG&E bill is received whether this comes at increased
280933 - cost for gas to heat the water, or if there is an actual cost savings.
280934 -
280935 - [On 110228 0614 PG&E shows 15% reduced utility bill,
280936 - ref SDS 7 UT9G, and 23% reduced therms, after installing
280937 - new water heater. ref SDS 7 HN6P
280939 - ..
280940 - [On 110228 0926 notified Gerry (landlord) that water heater
280941 - was replaced, and seems to provide reduced energy costs.
280942 - ref SDS 8 DL6O
280944 - ..
280945 - Questions on Warranty Repair....
280946 -
280947 - 1. Why must customer pay $137 for a Rheem water heater that
280948 - failed on a 6 year warranty after only 5 years? ref SDS 0
280949 - HC56
280950 -
280951 - 2. Why must customer pay $109 for parts to reinstall new water
280952 - heater, also, covered under the warranty? ref SDS 0 HC56
280954 - ..
280955 - 3. Why must customer pay $245 to reinstall a water heater
280956 - under warranty for 6 years that failed after 5 years?
280957 - ref SDS 0 XS58
280959 - ..
280960 - 4. Why is customer provided a water heater designated 50
280961 - gallons, but which actual capacity is only 48 gallons, to
280962 - replace a 50 gallon water heater? ref SDS 0 HC56
280964 - ..
280965 - 5. Why is a thermal expansion tank required for new water to
280966 - avoid failure of water heater installed in April 2006, and
280967 - which replaced a water heater that lasted for 12 years?
280968 - ref SDS 0 AG70
280969 -
280970 - [On 110208 1052 investigated charges with Heieck and
280971 - with Rheem. ref SDS 5 WS9N
280972 -
280973 -
280974 -
280975 -
280977 - ..
2810 -
2811 -
2812 - 2011
2813 -
281301 - Research found information on Rheem water heaters...
281302 -
281303 - Rheem Water Heaters...
281304 -
281305 - http://www.rheem.com/Products/tank_water_heaters/
281307 - ..
281308 - Customer support is shown at...
281309 -
281310 - http://www.rheem.com/products/tank_water_heaters/contact_support/
281311 -
281312 - 1 800 621 5622
281314 - ..
281315 - Research found information on Rheem water heaters...
281316 -
281317 - Glendale Plumbing...
281318 -
281319 -
281320 - http://www.gpfsupply.com/index~ID~,Plumbing,Water.Heaters,Gas.Water.Heater.,50.Gallon~path~find~ds~dept
281322 - ..
281323 - Rheem 22V50FN................. 48 G ...... $548.23
281324 - Rheem 22VR50FN................ 50 G ...... $548.26
281326 - ..
281327 - Both cost the same............................. $548
281328 -
281329 - Rheem 22VR50FN with 50 gallons is described as...
281330 -
281331 - High efficiency ultra low nox model
281332 -
281333 - Rheem 22V50FN with 48 gallons is merely ultra low nox, and
281334 - does no provide high efficiency, and so costs more per year in
281335 - heating expense.
281337 - ..
281338 - Accordingly, not clear why Heieck charged more money for a replacement
281339 - water heater that has less capacity, and does not provide high energy
281340 - efficiency?
281342 - ..
281343 - There is a lot of research indicating 22V50FN is being sold as a 50
281344 - gallon capacity.
281346 - ..
281347 - All of the research says this unit has a 6 year warranty for the water
281348 - heater tank and parts.
281350 - ..
281351 - Research found customers report problems Rheem failure to perform on
281352 - warranty...
281353 -
281354 - ConsumerAffairs.com
281355 -
281356 - http://www.consumeraffairs.com/homeowners/rheem.html
281357 -
281359 - ..
2814 -
2815 -
2816 - 2217
2817 -
281701 - Thermal Expansion Tank Added to Water Heater Configuration
281702 -
281703 - Research on the Internet found explanation of requirements for...
281704 -
281705 - Thermal Expansion Tank
281707 - ..
281708 - Watts
281709 - Water Safety and Flow Control
281710 -
281711 - http://www.watts.com/pages/learnAbout/thermalExpansion.asp?catId=64
281713 - ..
281714 - When water is heated it expands. For example, water heated
281715 - from 90øF to a thermostat setting of 140øF in a 40 gallon hot
281716 - water heater will expand by almost one-half gallon. This is
281717 - because when water is heated, its density decreases and its
281718 - volume expands (see below). Since water is not compressible,
281719 - the extra volume created by expansion must go someplace.
281720 - During no-flow periods in a system, pressure reducing valves,
281721 - backflow preventers, and other one-way valves are closed, thus
281722 - eliminating a path for expanded water to flow back to the
281723 - system supply. Hence, system pressure increases.
281725 - ..
281726 - When dangerous pressures are built up in a water heater,
281727 - internal parts may fail such as the internal flues, fittings or
281728 - water connections. If a flue way collapses it can lead to the
281729 - potential release of toxic gases, such as carbon monoxide into
281730 - living spaces. Thermal expansion can also lead to a ruptured
281731 - or distorted hot water heating tank and may void the
281732 - manufacturer's warranty (see below).
281734 - ..
281735 - Watts offers a wide variety of thermal expansion tanks. The choice of
281736 - which tank to use for a particular situation appears to be a complex
281737 - balancing of factors.
281739 - ..
281740 - Watts shows a schematic for configuring the thermal expansion tank
281741 - extended with a fitting to the inflow water line. This seems to align
281742 - with Kevin's work today, per above. ref SDS 0 II7H
281743 -
281744 - http://media.wattswater.com/2915055.pdf
281746 - ..
281747 - Inspection of thermal expansion tank installed by Kevin today, per
281748 - above, ref SDS 0 XS47, shows...
281749 -
281750 - American Water Heater Company
281751 - Potable water system
281752 - Model.............................. AET2
281753 - Serial number...................... 1011C002702
281755 - ..
281756 - Found Internet source for thermal expansion installation....
281757 -
281758 - American Water Heater Company
281759 -
281760 - http://www.americanwaterheater.com/products/pdf/exptank.pdf
281762 - ..
281763 - Their chart seems to indicate that AET2 is adequate for 50 gallon
281764 - rsidential water heater and for all inlet water pressures.
281765 -
281766 - [On 110209 1016 research on Internet found Use and Care
281767 - manual for Rheem water heater that seems to support for
281768 - configuration installed by Diablo Rooter today. ref SDS 6
281769 - IO5N
281771 - ..
281772 - Sizing for commercial installations requires AET5 for all water
281773 - temperatures. Not clear why residential sizing is based on water
281774 - pressure, and commercial is based on temperature.
281776 - ..
281777 - Called American Water Heater Company...
281778 -
281779 - http://www.americanwaterheater.com/
281780 -
281781 - 800 999-9515
281783 - ..
281784 - Talked to Ken.
281786 - ..
281787 - Ken advised that water heaters are designed to avoid failure due to
281788 - pressure from heating water. A T&P (temperature and pressure) relief
281789 - valve on the side of the water heater siphons off water to prevent
281790 - overflow and damage to the water heater.
281792 - ..
281793 - After talking to Ken, found Watts schematic showing T&P relief drain
281794 - system emptying to a floor draim below the water heater...
281795 -
281796 - http://www.watts.com/pages/learnAbout/thermalExpansion.asp?catId=64
281798 - ..
281799 - Installation here at 1158 St Matthew PL #103 is on the 2nd floor.
281800 - There is no floor drain. The water heater is elevated on wood slats
281801 - and the wood floor in the utility closet is protected by a galvanized
281802 - sheetmetal drip pan.
281804 - ..
281805 - During the call, Ken advised that water heaters are not installed with
281806 - thermal expansion tanks, because the T&P system is designed to avoid
281807 - this problem. Thermal expansion tanks are added when a water heater
281808 - begins to fail based on falling water pressure and temperature.
281809 - Inspection may show dripping from T&P system. The manufacturer then
281810 - recommends installing a thermal expansion tank, to avoid the cost of
281811 - replacing the entire water heater. In this case, the T&P system did
281812 - not overflow to a drain below, because it drains to a long copper
281813 - pipe outside.
281815 - ..
281816 - In this case, deformity to and from the top of the water heater is not
281817 - easily visible, ref SDS 0 KT3I, and so goes unnoticed, per Kevin's
281818 - inspection above.
281819 -
281820 -
281821 -
281822 -
281823 -
281824 -
281825 -
281826 -
2819 -